#TDSU Episode 233:

⏱️ Timestamps:

00:00:00 - Intro

00:01:21 - Candy and J.P.'s LinkedIn friendship

00:02:26 - What grinds Candy’s gears about job listings

00:03:16 - HR systems and the art of bad postings

00:03:39 - Nasty world, nasty work: J.P.'s rant

00:05:19 - When job descriptions change on you

00:06:10 - U.S. labor laws vs. global realities

00:06:56 - How to spot red flags when interviewing

00:08:02 - No barking, just closing thoughts

00:09:12 - Outro

📺 Lifetime Value: Your Destination for GTM content

Website: https://www.lifetimevaluemedia.com

🤝 Connect with the hosts:

Dillon's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dillonryoung

JP's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jeanpierrefrost/

Rob's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rob-zambito/

👋 Connect with Candy Irlanda:

Candy's LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/cirlanda

[JP] (0:00 - 0:20)

You could also get a job description that is perfect, primo. You go apply, you get interviews, and you get the job. And then, things change.

The company is not beholden. I have never seen anything where a company has to keep things exactly like it was stated in that job description.

[Dillon] (0:29 - 0:56)

What's up, lifers, and welcome to The Daily Standup with Lifetime Value, where we're giving you fresh new customer success ideas every single day. I got my man J.P. with us. J.P., do you want to say hi? J.P. barks J.P. barks I'm crying. Candy with us. Candy, can you please say hi?

[Candy] (0:57 - 1:02)

I'm not going to do the DMX barking, so thank you, J.P., for that warm welcome.

[Dillon] (1:03 - 1:13)

Yes, exactly. That's how we welcome people on this show. Good.

And I am your host. My name is Dillon Young. Candy, thank you so much for being here.

[Candy] (1:14 - 1:15)

Thank you for having me.

[Dillon] (1:16 - 1:21)

If, through your sobbing laughter, you can introduce yourself, please do so.

[Candy] (1:21 - 2:25)

Sure thing, Dillon. My name is Candy Irlanda. I have nothing to promote.

J.P. and I have been internet friends through LinkedIn for such a long time. We first met through the CS Insider Speed Mixer. Heyo, please join everyone.

And through following some of his posts, I realized that he was part of this program with a previous guest that was on the show, Kevin, through his Direction Customer Success Program. J.P. was the first class. I was the class behind him, and we just connected through there.

And very wonderful time. J.P., I will always shout this through the crowd. J.P., he's like my hype man when I want to be hyped up, or just for us to talk, shoot the breeze, and talk about anime and all that stuff. But really, just happy that he invited me to do this. So this is my first time. So yeah.

[Dillon] (2:26 - 2:48)

First time, but not your last time. Candy, you know what we do here? We ask every single guest one simple question.

J.P.'s dancing in the background on mute. If you're not on video, you ought to be. What is on your mind when it comes to customer...

I'm so messed up. I don't know how to handle this anymore. What is on your mind when it comes to customer success, Candy?

[Candy] (2:50 - 2:52)

What really grinds my gears, Dillon?

[Dillon] (2:52 - 2:53)

Hell yeah.

[Candy] (2:53 - 2:54)

Hell yeah.

[Dillon] (2:54 - 2:54)

Let's go.

[Candy] (2:55 - 3:15)

What grinds my gears, and this is a thing that I've noticed during my time of looking for a CSM job, is some of these postings, I've seen well-written job postings or job descriptions, and also seen terrible ones as well too. Some of these job descriptions could be a lot better.

[Dillon] (3:16 - 3:23)

Yeah, I think we could expand this out and just say, hey, can HR people and the systems they use do a better job? Do better, right?

[Candy] (3:23 - 3:28)

Do better. Be a good person first, and be a better writer on your job description.

[Dillon] (3:29 - 3:37)

Yeah, I mean, I don't know about good person. I'm just hoping they get their data entry correct. That's all I'm asking for.

J.P., jump on in here.

[JP] (3:39 - 3:47)

Yeah, I mean, look, what was my debut album called, Dillon? Nasty World?

[Dillon] (3:48 - 3:49)

Nasty Work.

[JP] (3:49 - 5:18)

Nasty World. Maybe that's what it is. Nasty Work, Nasty World.

You got to do nasty work in a nasty world. I think that, yes, to your point, we talked about this framework of keeping the framework alive here, these five types of CSMs that people look for, and how maybe by reading the job description, we can find out a lot about a role. But I think what you're bringing up is something that is actually really important, which is how accurate is that information?

I've learned over the years, these job descriptions, they look so official. You go in, and it's just, wow. But somebody had to put that together.

And sometimes that person, they may just be tasked with putting up a list of responsibilities, and no one's consulted. Maybe no one in customer success is consulted for this customer success job, right? So you may get job description that has several inaccuracies.

You could also get a job description that is perfect, primo. You go apply, you get interviews, you get there, maybe you get the job. And then things change.

So you could get a perfect, but nothing, the company is not beholden. I have never seen anything where a company has to keep things exactly like it was stated in that job description. And so that is where I put the balance, so to speak.

[Dillon] (5:19 - 5:53)

What I'll say is, to be fair, if you were to start a job with a certain job description, and they change it materially, you can quit and actually get unemployment, because it is no longer the same job for which you were hired. Now, I don't recommend that in this job market, but the idea is the law does recognize that they cannot just change your job significantly without repercussions if you're not qualified to do it or something like that.

[JP] (5:53 - 5:55)

Lead the witness. That's what we call leading the witness, baby.

[Candy] (5:56 - 6:08)

Also, can I point out too, that this only applies for US only, probably not Canada, probably not Mexico and our other global CSMs. So please- Don't worry about those people.

[Dillon] (6:08 - 6:09)

No, I'm kidding.

[Candy] (6:10 - 6:11)

Please look into your labor laws.

[JP] (6:11 - 6:12)

We love you around the world.

[Dillon] (6:13 - 6:19)

Is that one place where America has the leg up or the United States has the leg up?

[Candy] (6:20 - 6:55)

I'm not sure, to be honest. I just only know a little bit about HR stuff in the US, and because I live in California, and California is very employee friendly, are very strict about their rules and all that. If I was an hourly employee and I was like, let's say one minute late to clocking out for lunch, ding, HR is going to tag me and say, why didn't you clock out on time?

You're trying to skim from our systems. No, I just forgot. That's how strict we are in California with our employee loss.

[Dillon] (6:56 - 8:01)

I think to the other point, there's so many variables here. If you're interviewing at a company that has very few CSMs, then they may not have their job description very tight and appropriate. Could have been Googled.

If you've got a first time manager retiring, and they're the one responsible for creating a JD, you're going to be in trouble. Not necessarily in trouble, but maybe take it with a grain of salt. These are the sorts of questions you can be asking.

Hey, how big is the team? Is this a first time manager? How do you guys think about customer success overall?

Those are going to give you the signals that you can then bump up against that JD to understand, okay, is this really accurate about what I'm getting myself into? Then, of course, the maturity of the company or the age of the company will tell you how quickly that's all going to get stale. You ought to get realigned on what your goals are, because we all know working in early stage companies that those goals change often.

Candy, we are running out of time, but do you have any parting thoughts for the audience? Would you like to bark at them perhaps?

[Candy] (8:02 - 8:04)

No, not barking.

[Dillon] (8:04 - 8:17)

Okay, okay. Okay, I think that's it. Yeah, you know what?

[Candy] (8:17 - 8:19)

If you cut it just out to like no barking.

[Dillon] (8:20 - 8:27)

No barking. No, I got to leave it in where you laugh so hard you wheeze, otherwise it doesn't make any sense.

[Candy] (8:28 - 8:36)

If that can be deleted, oh my God, Jeff's kiss. Just us laughing.

[Dillon] (8:37 - 9:04)

That is our time. Love it. Love the topic.

I think it's important for folks to keep their head on a swivel as they're out here looking for jobs. Not all jobs are created equal, and not all jobs maintain their quality throughout your time there. You've got to look out for yourself, and you put your critical thinking cap on when you're out here looking for jobs.

Candy, love the conversation. Come back soon. Tell us some more things that grind your gears.

Maybe this can be a recurring segment, but for now, we love you so much.

[Candy] (9:06 - 9:07)

Bye, y'all.

[VO] (9:12 - 9:48)

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